2012 Kawasaki Mean Streak
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I just joined, and want to thank everyone for helping me decide on what to purchase as my first motorcycle. Long story short - my dad always had a bike and after I decided to hit my mid-life crisis early and got used to the seriously bad drivers here in AZ (originally from South Jersey) I decided to get a bike. I have a 2004 Suzuki Marauder 1600 (this is made by Kawasaki and is a Mean Streak with different fender and headlight). I took a MSF course on a dirt bike (never rode anything with a hand clutch in my life) then the next day started on the 1600 I already bought.
This bike has been awesome for the 7 months I've been riding (I put about 4,000 miles on it since January). It is equipped with a Kuryakin pro-series hypercharger, Cobra Speedster Longs, and PC3 USB. It passed emissions when I bought it in December (friend rode it for me) and I can do figure 8's or go about 1mph through my neighborhood and it was smooth as silk. Never had a problem at any speed until recently.
I always start it with the high idle knob out if it sits for more than 30 minutes since the cold idle solenoids no longer exist and the rpm don't hit 950 right away (more like 750). Once warm it was always between 900 and 1000 rpm, and no problems. the other day I went into a store and came out, pulled the high idle knob out and started it as usual and it sounded like crap (cadence was off). I pushed the knob back in after just a few seconds and the idle was at almost 2000 and still sounded bad. I adjusted the idle adjustment knob all the way down and it was at about 1100 rpm. I rode it and if I held the throttle perfectly still in 1st gear it would jerk forward and then return to normal, then jerk, repeat. It was acting like I was opening and closing the throttle. If I roll on the throttle (even slowly) in any gear it is fine, and at higher speeds (highway 70mph) it is fine to hold stead and the RMP are stable and about the same as they were previously.
I checked what I could and couldn't find a leak at the intake manifold with WD40, no hose leaks, etc. I swallowed my pride and took it to a Kawasaki dealer for service and they have had it 2 1/2 days and are stumped. They say it is running rich whether the PC3 is connected or not and don't know why. they tested the TPS and found no problems. I imagine they've checked the fuel injectors, etc.
Any ideas what's wrong suddenly? Keep in mind this bike was running awesome at all speeds from 0-107mph (taking 10% speedo error into account). Mountain roads, no problem at any speed. Parking lots, no problem.
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since the cold idle solenoids are no longer there im assuming you have an aftermarket intake. either way you might want to check the vacuum line that the solenoids hooked to they should be plugged/blocked off completely if one off them is sucking air it will run like crap. this has happened to me before
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Based on the sequence of events, I would take a closer look that 'choke' cable and what it's doing to the position of the throttle, even when the knob is pushed all the way in. You may have to remove the tank to get a good look at what is going on around the throttle body. This assumes that everything the dealer checked really is OK and that URIAHK's hose suggestion isn't a problem.
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
Thanks for the replies. Just got off the phone with the shop and asked them to check both the "choke" and cables as well as the vacuum lines that should be plugged. I also reminded them to check the fuel injectors if they haven't already. The only update they were really able to give me (this is before they checked what you suggested) was that when they change the map on the PC3 one of the cylinders isn't changing at all. I suggested checking compression to make sure the engine and valves are not damaged. I have gradually started pulling harder at stop lights over the past couple months, shifting at about 4,000 rpm through the first 3 gears instead of around 3,000rpm (then hit speed limit and relax it). I don't imagine that would damage it since red line is 6,000. I have 50w 20 semi-syn in it right now since temps are over 100 degrees, otherwise I was using 10W 40 full syn. I did have a miss shift from 2nd to 3rd the day it started acting up, but was under 4,000 rpm and it was still running perfectly at all speeds, even from complete stop and crawling behind cars, and rpms were normal.
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Oh, Uriahk - correct - I have the pro-series hypercharger and maintain the K+N filter regularly. by the way, that 06 of yours is sweat! There was one I wanted and was for sale for $4,000 when I was looking to buy, but no bank in the area (he was almost in Mexico) that I could get a loan through and the owner had to sign it over at a bank.
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I remember hearing a very similiar problem on a z1000. The pc3 unit looked like it was working, but it wasn't. I am unfamiliar with your mods, but would the bike run without the pc3? If you disconnect it and it runs, you have found your problem.
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
thanks aodrn for the reply, and you may be right about the PC3 - we'll see. The shop did tell me they disconnected the PC3 and it was still running rich, which is the opposite of what I'd expect since the hypercharger intake should make it run lean without the PC3 mapping. I'll share some of my ignorance in hopes for education - I am not exactly sure how the idle adjustment knob (between the V of the engine) changes the RPM. I turned it all the way counter-clockwise after it suddenly idled high and that brought it down to 1100 rpm (should be about 950) - but does turning the knob affect the fuel/air mix to change RPM? If so, does lowering the RPM by turning it counter clockwise make it run more rich or more lean? Keep in mind this is a fuel injected bike.
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Fuel injection works using a throttle position sensor. This sensor tells the computer how far open the throttle blades are. Depending on other variables from other sensors, this tells the computer how much fuel to give. Turning the idle adjustment on your bike just opens or closes the blades slightly and then the computer compensates by giving more or less gas. It is exactly the same as opening the throttle by twisting the grip.
As far as running rich...If the bike is running SMOOTHLY without the pc3, I would just replace it. It is very possible to run rich in certain areas of the powerband even though you are moving more air. Overall, you may run lean at high rpm with a more open exhaust or intake, but at lower rpm you could very well be rich with stock fueling. This is why you can't just increase fuel pressure to make up for open exhaust. The pc3 allows fine tuning for the entire range of load and rpm. If you get time, compare some of the fuel maps off the website. The open exhaust and intake maps will usually have negative fueling in the lower rpm ranges.
Keep me updated, I would feel really smart if I guessed right
Here is a map I had for example
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Oh, Uriahk - correct - I have the pro-series hypercharger and maintain the K+N filter regularly. by the way, that 06 of yours is sweat! There was one I wanted and was for sale for $4,000 when I was looking to buy, but no bank in the area (he was almost in Mexico) that I could get a loan through and the owner had to sign it over at a bank.
thank you very much i love it and i hope you get your problem solved
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Thanks for the replies. Just got off the phone with the shop and asked them to check both the "choke" and cables as well as the vacuum lines that should be plugged. I also reminded them to check the fuel injectors if they haven't already. The only update they were really able to give me (this is before they checked what you suggested) was that when they change the map on the PC3 one of the cylinders isn't changing at all. I suggested checking compression to make sure the engine and valves are not damaged. I have gradually started pulling harder at stop lights over the past couple months, shifting at about 4,000 rpm through the first 3 gears instead of around 3,000rpm (then hit speed limit and relax it). I don't imagine that would damage it since red line is 6,000. I have 50w 20 semi-syn in it right now since temps are over 100 degrees, otherwise I was using 10W 40 full syn. I did have a miss shift from 2nd to 3rd the day it started acting up, but was under 4,000 rpm and it was still running perfectly at all speeds, even from complete stop and crawling behind cars, and rpms were normal.
Wait a minute. Initially you said the shop said that it's running rich whether the PC3 is connected or not - implying the PC3 is OK and not part of the problem. Now the shop says if they change maps in the PC3, one cylinder 'doesn't change' ? Do they mean the map for one cylinder doesn't change but the other one does ? Are they aware that the PC3 can use one map for both cylinders, or an individual map (2 separate maps) for each cylinder ? Is their comment based on what they see in the PC3 software, or based on an A/F measurement in the exhaust of each cylinder (which I doubt they're doing) ?
To rule out the PC3, they should disconnect if from the injectors and let the stock ECU run the injectors. If the problem is still there, then the PC3 is not the problem and they can forget about it for the time being and stop worrying about maps and such crap. That would also mean that either the stock ECU has developed a problem (rare but not unheard of), or the problem is one of the items suggested previously. If they disconnect the PC3 from the injectors and the problem goes away, then the PC3 is the problem. A PC3 that develops trouble is also not unheard of.
BTW the so-called "choke" knob/cable is not a choke at all. It's a fast idle knob. When you pull it out, it simply opens the throttle plates a little. Chokes are not used with fuel injection. So if your last action before the problem started was to pull on the "choke" (fast idle) knob, and this thing is idleing way too fast, I'd be suspecting that first. Hence my previous recommendation. But with a PC3 present, it's certainly worth ruling it out because it too can cause this problem.
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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Good comments- thanks everyone (and I appreciate the bit of humor AODRN - I will for sure let you know if you get some bragging rights). Unfortunately the shop is closed Sundays and Mondays and they didn't get back to me yesterday (so they hadn't figured it out yet). I will ask for clarity as VA3UX suggested on what they mean about one cylinder not responding and how that is measured. I will also ask if they tried riding it a low speed without the PC3 hooked up since it does make sense that the intake wouldn't be providing significantly more air at low rpm - and the problem is only at low RPM in low gear anyway (the jerky part). Man do I hope that the cable on the fast idle knob is catching something - sounds like a cheap fix (I will let the shop do it since they have been spending so much time on my one hour diagnosis fee and the guy who answers the phone has great customer service when I call for updates).
I hope everyone is having a good weekend. My moonlight river kayaking trip got cancelled last night due to the storm and clouds hiding the moon (not enough testosterone in me to go on the river blind) - so instead I woke up to some empty IPA bottles and cans of Coors).
P.S. - it does feel good to know you folks are out there and helping to educate me. Wish I could help out on other threads, but the only mechanical stuff I know is when something goes bad on one of my vehicles (having a Polaris quad really made me a better garage mechanic).
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When was the last time you cleaned the throttle bodies? I would do that and run a tank of sea foam through it.
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1. Get the PC3 totally unhooked and see how it runs. If it runs OK, there is your problem.
2. Do you have a vacuum leak in the HyperCharger vane actuator? (Can it hold the vanes closed for a long time if you pull a vacuum and pinch the hose shut?)
3. Make sure the hose/port for the solenoid vaccum is sealed.
4. Is the throttle cable/linkage opening the throttles smoothly?
I have a very similar setup on my '04.
Sounds like your dealer technicians are very weak in their skills- maybe a different shop would be helpful.
Good luck.
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Ignore. Almost Double post.
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
Uriahk you were on the money!!! (you too Boscoe - and I actually planned to take it to another shop Friday when I have off if they hadn't fixed it by then). The shop called and you could hear the smile on the guy's face when he said they fixed it. I previously sent them the instructions for the hypercharger intake and they saw that the solenoid vacuum hose was no longer plugged. They called back an hour later to say it is back together and running "awesome." Even though I'm really, really cheap I agreed to pay one hour diagnostic and one extra hour since they checked so many things and put about 6 hours into diagnostic. I could've saved $160 if I joined the forum sooner though (when you start to think there may be serious problems, 2 hours labor becomes a relief). You all totally helped on this as I called the shop with all of your suggestions.
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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Rasmith, thanks for bringing up cleaning the throttle bodies. I'm new to motorcycles (January 2012) and not sure how to and how often to clean the throttle bodies. I learn things as I go, and want to do proper maintenance. How do you clean the throttle bodies with sea foam? Keep in mind, when I think throttle body (singular) I think the whole $800 throttle assembly, so you are dealing with a real life newbie here. I do change my own fluids, brakes, and other simple stuff and am handy once I figure stuff out.
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Take off the right dog Dish. The throttle body is the part with the butterflies in it..Sometimes a dirt ridge will build up where the butterflies seat against the inside of the body when fully closed. I spray a little throttle body cleaner (Part Plus) and use a soft toothbrush..Do not use a wire brush or anything abrasive. Try not to spray too much in there and use a soft cloth to clean of the residue. Try to get the outer edges of the butterflies as well.
The seafoam, you add to your gas at the prescribed ratio. That helps clean injectors and other parts of the fuel delivery system.
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
sounds simple enough. thank you - I'll clean it out.
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glad to hear you got your problems solved now you can ride the snot out of it
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glad to hear you got your problems solved now you can ride the snot out of it
What did I miss?
Source: https://www.riderforums.com/threads/mean-streak-is-jerky-and-idles-high.71817/
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